The British Museum site says the deck was printed in Wels (Austria), 18th century.
I like the simple, a bit childish, lines. The emperor does not have a globus cruciger, and his legs do not form the roman digit 4, but the four of coins does have a globus, as if to say it is the empror's domain.
Re: Help identify Les tarot of Marseille
2hi,
I remember you from old tmes .... 20 years ago.
"le emperur" .... possibly this indicates a local dialect.
https://www.google.com/search?client=op ... =970&dpr=1
"laimperatrice"
https://www.google.com/search?q="laimpe ... AHoECAEQAA
It looks to me, as if Napoleon was often addressed as "emperur" and Josephine at least in one case as "laimperatrice".
********************
The 2 of coins shows something which looks like WELS ... the S is a little bit strange.
WELS is a location in Austria.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wels
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wels_(Stadt)
They play Tarock there ....
https://www.google.com/search?q=wels+ta ... s-wiz-serp
There at least 8 Tarot Wahrsager in Wels
https://www.google.com/search?q=wels+ta ... s-wiz-serp
There is a pdf ... you should find it with ...
It has this text and some more ...
http://a.trionfi.eu/WWPCM/WWPCM/austria/aust-histor.htm
has from Wels ...
Pdf about Wels playing card production
https://www.zobodat.at/pdf/JOM_136a_0245-0250.pdf
Book from 1820
https://books.google.de/books?id=xcRcAA ... en&f=false
Again about the exhibition
https://www.ooegeschichte.at/media/migr ... 13-014.pdf
Pdf about Salzburg with playing card producers from Wels
https://www.zobodat.at/pdf/MGSL_133_0275-0322.pdf
List with card producers in Ober-Österreich (also Wels)
http://www.talon.cc/Kartenmacher-OOE/Wels/_Wels.html
I remember in a vague way a Tarock card, which was in an interesting way ugly, somehow from Austria, mid 18th century, somehow similar to the Emperur. Somehow I've published it here, but this is a djungle.
******************
This is a treasure ...
http://www.talon.cc/Talon-Inhalt/Inhalt01.html
I remember you from old tmes .... 20 years ago.
"le emperur" .... possibly this indicates a local dialect.
https://www.google.com/search?client=op ... =970&dpr=1
"laimperatrice"
https://www.google.com/search?q="laimpe ... AHoECAEQAA
It looks to me, as if Napoleon was often addressed as "emperur" and Josephine at least in one case as "laimperatrice".
********************
The 2 of coins shows something which looks like WELS ... the S is a little bit strange.
WELS is a location in Austria.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wels
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wels_(Stadt)
They play Tarock there ....
https://www.google.com/search?q=wels+ta ... s-wiz-serp
There at least 8 Tarot Wahrsager in Wels
https://www.google.com/search?q=wels+ta ... s-wiz-serp
There is a pdf ... you should find it with ...
in the search engine.„Diese Karden seind zu finden bey … Spielkarten aus ...http://s0b26131ed2d5b309.jimcontent.com
It has this text and some more ...
My notes: The most successfull producers were Peter Schachner (Wels) and the Spielkartenfabrik Eurich (founded 1809). Followers of Schachner were Josef Dimler and Heinrich Leeb (both from Wels).Kartenmaler und Kartenfabrikanten in Oberösterreich. Kartenmaler gab es in Freistadt (ab 1798), Linz (ab 1661), Ried i.I. (ab 1660, Steyr (1567) und Wels (ab 1533).
http://a.trionfi.eu/WWPCM/WWPCM/austria/aust-histor.htm
has from Wels ...
...without cardsWels Georg Ziegler 1626-1635
Wels Hans Prenner 1646-1674
Wels Johann Windter (Wendter) 1718-1735
Wels Peter Schachner 1787-1819
Wels Joseph Dimler 1819-1861
Pdf about Wels playing card production
https://www.zobodat.at/pdf/JOM_136a_0245-0250.pdf
Book from 1820
https://books.google.de/books?id=xcRcAA ... en&f=false
Again about the exhibition
https://www.ooegeschichte.at/media/migr ... 13-014.pdf
Pdf about Salzburg with playing card producers from Wels
https://www.zobodat.at/pdf/MGSL_133_0275-0322.pdf
List with card producers in Ober-Österreich (also Wels)
http://www.talon.cc/Kartenmacher-OOE/Wels/_Wels.html
I remember in a vague way a Tarock card, which was in an interesting way ugly, somehow from Austria, mid 18th century, somehow similar to the Emperur. Somehow I've published it here, but this is a djungle.
******************
This is a treasure ...
http://www.talon.cc/Talon-Inhalt/Inhalt01.html
Huck
http://trionfi.com
http://trionfi.com
Re: Help identify Les tarot of Marseille
3Yes, I've been around a while.
Thank you!Huck wrote: 17 Nov 2022, 04:41 "le emperur" .... possibly this indicates a local dialect.
https://www.google.com/search?client=op ... =970&dpr=1
<snip>
Re: Help identify Les tarot of Marseille
4I can imagine, that some people in Austria would be interested to see these 5 cards. And possibly they have more information about them. Or do you have more than these 5?
I'd written ..
https://www.britishmuseum.org/collectio ... 6-0501-197 .... the deck is dated to 1750.
... its not the same, but in some aspects similar.
and a producer (Schober or Schoper) appears on the list of the Wels producers ....
http://www.talon.cc/Kartenmacher-OOE/Wels/_Wels.html .... Ober-Österreicher Kartenmacher
1762 - 1785 Christian Schober aus Neuhaus in Böhmen (but related to Wels)
I'd written ..
I indeed found this deck ....I remember in a vague way a Tarock card, which was in an interesting way ugly, somehow from Austria, mid 18th century, somehow similar to the Emperur. Somehow I've published it here, but this is a djungle.
https://www.britishmuseum.org/collectio ... 6-0501-197 .... the deck is dated to 1750.
... its not the same, but in some aspects similar.
and a producer (Schober or Schoper) appears on the list of the Wels producers ....
http://www.talon.cc/Kartenmacher-OOE/Wels/_Wels.html .... Ober-Österreicher Kartenmacher
1762 - 1785 Christian Schober aus Neuhaus in Böhmen (but related to Wels)
Last edited by Huck on 18 Nov 2022, 01:33, edited 1 time in total.
Huck
http://trionfi.com
http://trionfi.com
Re: Help identify Les tarot of Marseille
5Yes, here - https://www.britishmuseum.org/collectio ... 6-0501-784Huck wrote: 17 Nov 2022, 16:52 I can imagine, that some people in Austria would be interested to see these 5 cards. And possibly they have more information about them. Or do you have more than these 5?
Re: Help identify Les tarot of Marseille
6Under this condition I would assume, that the Austrian researchers naturally know these cards.
Once I made this longer list for Germany/Austria/Switzerland ...
viewtopic.php?p=11693&sid=6eeb5eb71d087 ... 355#p11693
Once I made this longer list for Germany/Austria/Switzerland ...
viewtopic.php?p=11693&sid=6eeb5eb71d087 ... 355#p11693
Huck
http://trionfi.com
http://trionfi.com