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Re: Hello! - and kind question for help w.r.t. the etymology of tarot

Addendum III: The register on page 658 / 659 under the rubrum "Spiel" points to more entries: on page 129, from 1476: playing cards is generally forbidden, with the exception that there is an official supervisor. No card game name given. on page 224, from 1450, see footnote b on p. 223, pl...

Re: Hello! - and kind question for help w.r.t. the etymology of tarot

Addendum II: On page 638, the register tells us that "karneffeln" only appears on page 86, the well-known reference. Hence, if the book contains all Nördlinger Stadtrechte, there is no further --and thus: earlier-- reference to Karnöffel than the one on page 86 from, apparently, 1510. Now ...

Re: Hello! - and kind question for help w.r.t. the etymology of tarot

Addendum: It seems that the author of the book Especially important is the last part published in 1933. https://drw-www.adw.uni-heidelberg.de/drw-cgi/zeige?index=buecher&term=noerdlingenstr.&seite=o02titr&blaettere= There it might be of interest to understand the complete book, not only ...

Re: Hello! - and kind question for help w.r.t. the etymology of tarot

Dear Huck, thanks for the message - then we wait for Jonas Richter and his expertise. I did take a look into the book https://drw-www.adw.uni-heidelberg.de/drw-cgi/zeige?index=buecher&term=noerdlingenstr.&seite=o02titr&blaettere= as you proposed [...] Especially important is the last par...

Re: Hello! - and kind question for help w.r.t. the etymology of tarot

Dear Huck and dear mikeh, sorry for responding so late, I first wanted to finish first the post(s) on the etymology of Karnöffel = carneval as an event-situation in the game --and not as a depiction of a person as an Unter-- ( http://forum.tarothistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1033&p=23630#p...

Re: Collection ... Karnöffel

Thanks Huck and Nathanael for your nice answers! I am quite happy that at least some of the hypotheses seem to yield some new insights. And sorry again for making the posts so long, I simply can't help that I am thinking in long arcs. I try to make it better in the upcoming posts. Perhaps after the ...

Re: Collection ... Karnöffel

[continued from the previous post...] By this structure King, Ober, Unter, Banner, Karnöffel represents in each plain suit a strong military and social order in order to represent stability in normal life. Each king has its kingdom, but as especially these times of the 13th/14th-century tell: normal...

Re: Collection ... Karnöffel

[continued from the previous post...] On the same webpage https://www.parlettgames.uk/histocs/karnoeffel.html , one finds the gameplay after van Leyden & Dummet, therein the value of the cards: Trump : properties Karnöffel = J : beats everything Pope = 6 : trumps plain suits Kaiser = 2 : trumps ...

Re: Collection ... Karnöffel

[continued from the previous post...] And w.r.t. 1820 A Karnöffelamt in Neumünster [...] 1235. Das Karnüffelamt zu Neumünster. [1005] (S. Jahrb. f. Schleswig Bd. VI. S. 398.) Es ist bekannt, daß unter allen zu Anfang des 16. Jhdts. in Deutschland getriebenen Kartenspielen das sogenannte Karnüffelspi...

Re: Collection ... Karnöffel

[continued from the previous post...] And hence, if you connect the two sets of evidences, the first containing all the starting “c”- Carnöffel with the second containing all the “f”-spelling-Carnefale, then it becomes quite obvious –at least for me—that the melody goes: carneval, carnefal, carnöfal...

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